Author Topic: lying to your rebreather  (Read 3316 times)

Offline Paul Dowling

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lying to your rebreather
« on: October 06, 2009, 12:49:42 PM »
Any thoughts on lying to your computer to cut your deco.
Sent from my brain using my hand

Offline Andy

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2009, 12:51:16 PM »
Lots of thoughts but none of them good.

I'd lie to a woman but lying to my unit is bad for my health!

Andy

Offline Stephen McMullan

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2009, 01:04:07 PM »
My missus knows when I've done something wrong and I don't even need to open my mouth to speak. In fact she's got an uncanny ability to foretell when I'm about to do something wrong.

Maybe APD can program a "wife check" into the startup routine for the Vision.

"YOU'RE A BAD BOY - NO DIVE"



Offline Ding

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2009, 02:26:46 PM »
My missus knows when I've done something wrong and I don't even need to open my mouth to speak. In fact she's got an uncanny ability to foretell when I'm about to do something wrong.

Maybe APD can program a "wife check" into the startup routine for the Vision.

"YOU'RE A BAD BOY - NO DIVE"

Your so right there.  ;D ;D
Inspo Classic

Offline Fintan Lowney

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2009, 02:44:13 PM »
Leave in the water and just get out !!!!

Offline scuba steve

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2009, 03:46:14 PM »
is that not like selling your soul to the devil  :devilban:     :sarcasm:

if my lips are movin im liein

Offline tonyf

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2009, 10:52:50 PM »
Any thoughts on lying to your computer to cut your deco.


Dont think your computer will mind ;)  But its not going to get the aches and pains.

Tony

Offline Andy

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2009, 11:18:40 PM »
Any thoughts on lying to your computer to cut your deco.


Dont think your computer will mind ;)  But its not going to get the aches and pains.

Tony

It will when you start hitting it with a hammer and say "damm thing, why didn't it warn me!"

Offline tonyf

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #8 on: October 06, 2009, 11:53:44 PM »
Any thoughts on lying to your computer to cut your deco.


Dont think your computer will mind ;)  But its not going to get the aches and pains.



It will when you start hitting it with a hammer and say "damm thing, why didn't it warn me!"
:stupid: :stupid: :stupid:

Offline tonyf

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2009, 12:00:09 AM »
Any thoughts on lying to your computer to cut your deco.

On a more serious note IMHO. If you are running a different deco model that reflects the true gas you are using and are 100% sure that with your run times it will get you out of the water safe and sound. Its your choice.

Classic Inspo sounds good for this way of diving.

Cheers
Tony


Offline Stewart Andrews

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #10 on: October 07, 2009, 01:15:17 AM »
It dosen't matter a whole lot what your inerts are (He or N2), except in small subtle ways - the He offgases a bit sooner (deeper). It is all just inerts.

The trick is to achieve quality decompression, right from the end of the bottom time - and there are many factors that you have to get right to achieve this (too many to explain and get the right emphasis here).
In very very brief (AND PLEASE DO NOT FOLLOW THIS ALONE):
Hydration (previous 24 hours),
Circulation (moving most of the deco) and
Open the oxygen window (increase ppO2 if you feel OK and are not using large muscle groups - watch your buoyancy).

Seeing as this is a tech forum, I can say this here (cos I know that I will not be shot down in flames, don't I!).....I know a guy who cut 103 minutes of deco  off his Vision software after a 42 minute dive to 105m last Monday, without any worries of becoming bent. Total dive time was 3 hours and 50 minutes. DIL was unchanged during the dive and was 6/70. The set point was changed from 1.3 (during the bottom time) to 1.5 just after the ascent began. CNS clock was almost 200% at the end of the dive and OTU clock was about 150% (deep dive the previous day).
By the way, in case you are wondering, the time cut off the deco was not that based on a 1.3 set point whilst leaving the bottom - it was the time remaining allowing for the higher ppO2 during the dive.

Th diver left the water when the loop volume kept collapsing and the ADV was trying to cut in, whilst running on pure O2. Hence, no more inerts being offgassed.

If you want to know more, you can come to one of the talks that Stephen is hosting - probably in January or February.

Cheers,
Stewie
Stewie
'We are not here for a long time - just a good time'

Eurotek 2010 Golden Snorkel award winner

Offline Kevin Deady

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #11 on: October 07, 2009, 09:29:54 AM »


Th diver left the water when the loop volume kept collapsing and the ADV was trying to cut in, whilst running on pure O2. Hence, no more inerts being offgassed.


The diver needs to be very clued in and bouyancy needs to be very good before they should start using this however it is a very good indicator of when you have finished off gassing. I don't do the run times that i can cut off hours of deco! but i don't get out of the water until the lungs have collapsed and i need to inject O2 manually to keep them from crushing down.
Regards,
Kevin.

kevin.deady@gmail.com

Offline Paul Dowling

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #12 on: October 07, 2009, 09:35:54 AM »
It dosen't matter a whole lot what your inerts are (He or N2), except in small subtle ways - the He offgases a bit sooner (deeper). It is all just inerts.

The trick is to achieve quality decompression, right from the end of the bottom time - and there are many factors that you have to get right to achieve this (too many to explain and get the right emphasis here).
In very very brief (AND PLEASE DO NOT FOLLOW THIS ALONE):
Hydration (previous 24 hours),
Circulation (moving most of the deco) and
Open the oxygen window (increase ppO2 if you feel OK and are not using large muscle groups - watch your buoyancy).

Seeing as this is a tech forum, I can say this here (cos I know that I will not be shot down in flames, don't I!).....I know a guy who cut 103 minutes of deco  off his Vision software after a 42 minute dive to 105m last Monday, without any worries of becoming bent. Total dive time was 3 hours and 50 minutes. DIL was unchanged during the dive and was 6/70. The set point was changed from 1.3 (during the bottom time) to 1.5 just after the ascent began. CNS clock was almost 200% at the end of the dive and OTU clock was about 150% (deep dive the previous day).
By the way, in case you are wondering, the time cut off the deco was not that based on a 1.3 set point whilst leaving the bottom - it was the time remaining allowing for the higher ppO2 during the dive.

Th diver left the water when the loop volume kept collapsing and the ADV was trying to cut in, whilst running on pure O2. Hence, no more inerts being offgassed.

If you want to know more, you can come to one of the talks that Stephen is hosting - probably in January or February.

Cheers,
Stewie

Good post would like to head to the talks sounds very interesting.


« Last Edit: October 07, 2009, 09:38:34 AM by Paul Dowling »
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Offline Stephen McMullan

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #13 on: October 07, 2009, 11:09:31 AM »
Yeah it'll be post Xmas for that one and I'm looking forward to it. It'll be great timing to start thinking afresh about the principles of deco and the practicalities of managing the juggling act that is hang time on the deeper dives prior to the season.

From conversation with Stewart optimal decompression for CCR divers doing very deep dives is only one aspect to the presentation. OK technical divers are perhaps closer to the edge than others and some tech divers know exactly where the edge is as it looms large on most of their dives. However there will also be a lot of information for divers who are staying within no-deco limits or getting into decompression diving but whose over reliance on a computer profile and lack of attention to other factors which could potentially lead to an incident are exposing themselves to an unnecessary degree of risk. I'll certainly be encouraging any club divers within my own club with half an interest in their own safety to attend this talk as there are lessons for everyone.

S
« Last Edit: October 07, 2009, 11:16:00 AM by Stephen McMullan »

Offline Eoin OBeara

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Re: lying to your rebreather
« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2009, 11:24:15 AM »
I'd be very keen on making that talk, but will not be around...
Any chance of a podcast?  ;)
Ta,
Eoin

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